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	<title>Comments on: CS4&#8217;s Application Frame: Yea or Nea?</title>
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	<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php</link>
	<description>InDesignSecrets Blog and Podcast</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 09 Feb 2012 16:44:57 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: TP</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-485673</link>
		<dc:creator>TP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Sep 2010 10:07:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-485673</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t care for application frame. Glad that I have the option to not use application on my mac.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t care for application frame. Glad that I have the option to not use application on my mac.</p>
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		<title>By: Eugene</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-470565</link>
		<dc:creator>Eugene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 15:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-470565</guid>
		<description>Pity this doesn&#039;t work the same as for when you&#039;re using Photoshop, Illustrator, Imageready et al Adobe software, because I can double click the gray background and it opens the dialog box, but InDesign doesn&#039;t, well not CS3, does it in CS4?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pity this doesn&#8217;t work the same as for when you&#8217;re using Photoshop, Illustrator, Imageready et al Adobe software, because I can double click the gray background and it opens the dialog box, but InDesign doesn&#8217;t, well not CS3, does it in CS4?</p>
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		<title>By: Lee</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-469538</link>
		<dc:creator>Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 11:26:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-469538</guid>
		<description>I love this feature! Can’t wait to get CS4.

I have never, and will never, understand the way Mac applications have the desktop showing in the background.

I don’t want to see the desktop. For several reasons…

1. In my opinion, the desktop is not a good place to work from. It’s fine for just dropping the odd thing temporarily, but if you have all your work on the desktop, to access it you have to clear everything out of the way so you can see the desktop. Then you have to look around the whole screen to see the contents (in some cases, the folder may even be off the screen!). Then you have to double-click the folder to open it. Why bother with all this when the Finder lets you easily access any folder with one click? Oh, and working on the desktop also means your work is on the same drive as the operating system, which is slower and less secure.

2. If your desktop wallpaper isn’t black, or grey, then the colours are going to put you off your design!

3. I just find it really cluttered and confusing being able to see other apps/the desktop while I’m trying to work. I don’t like clutter.  I don’t have any toolbars or palettes open in InDesign. I just want my screen to be filled with the document. The “Mac” way is like bad feng shui — I don’t feel “secure” when I use an application, I feel lost.

4. On a Mac, if you click on the desktop for any reason, you are likely to lose the contents of your copy buffer. (Not sure if this still happens, but it taught me to never click on the desktop while working on a Mac.)

If it were up to me, InDesign documents would not be in a window at all, they would just fill the whole screen and you’d have tabs to move between documents.

I’ll admit, I prefer PCs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love this feature! Can’t wait to get CS4.</p>
<p>I have never, and will never, understand the way Mac applications have the desktop showing in the background.</p>
<p>I don’t want to see the desktop. For several reasons…</p>
<p>1. In my opinion, the desktop is not a good place to work from. It’s fine for just dropping the odd thing temporarily, but if you have all your work on the desktop, to access it you have to clear everything out of the way so you can see the desktop. Then you have to look around the whole screen to see the contents (in some cases, the folder may even be off the screen!). Then you have to double-click the folder to open it. Why bother with all this when the Finder lets you easily access any folder with one click? Oh, and working on the desktop also means your work is on the same drive as the operating system, which is slower and less secure.</p>
<p>2. If your desktop wallpaper isn’t black, or grey, then the colours are going to put you off your design!</p>
<p>3. I just find it really cluttered and confusing being able to see other apps/the desktop while I’m trying to work. I don’t like clutter.  I don’t have any toolbars or palettes open in InDesign. I just want my screen to be filled with the document. The “Mac” way is like bad feng shui — I don’t feel “secure” when I use an application, I feel lost.</p>
<p>4. On a Mac, if you click on the desktop for any reason, you are likely to lose the contents of your copy buffer. (Not sure if this still happens, but it taught me to never click on the desktop while working on a Mac.)</p>
<p>If it were up to me, InDesign documents would not be in a window at all, they would just fill the whole screen and you’d have tabs to move between documents.</p>
<p>I’ll admit, I prefer PCs.</p>
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		<title>By: heavyboots</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-469526</link>
		<dc:creator>heavyboots</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 23:59:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-469526</guid>
		<description>@Ray: You can minimize windows to the Dock, which gets them pretty far out of the way. cmd-H hides the current app, cmd-opt-H hides all other apps except the current one. And of course there&#039;s opt-click...

More importantly, I think you need to investigate Expose and a multi-button mouse. I set button 5 up to be Show Desktop and button 4 to be Show All Windows. (And Control-button 3 to be Show Dashboard).

Through Expose, you can swoosh around through all your open windows or grab something off the Desktop with ease and speed. An example would be a picture file you need to attach to an email. Button 4 to click to the window you need, button 1 down (ie, left click) and HOLD to pick up the file, button 4 to fan out your windows so you can choose your Mail message again and then let up on button 1 to drop the file as an attachment into the email.

EDIT: And FWIW, I am sort of against the frames thing because it splits the userbase into those who like it and those who don&#039;t. Which means I have to dictate a preference so that our stations remain interchangeable. More pain for the IT mgr.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ray: You can minimize windows to the Dock, which gets them pretty far out of the way. cmd-H hides the current app, cmd-opt-H hides all other apps except the current one. And of course there&#8217;s opt-click&#8230;</p>
<p>More importantly, I think you need to investigate Expose and a multi-button mouse. I set button 5 up to be Show Desktop and button 4 to be Show All Windows. (And Control-button 3 to be Show Dashboard).</p>
<p>Through Expose, you can swoosh around through all your open windows or grab something off the Desktop with ease and speed. An example would be a picture file you need to attach to an email. Button 4 to click to the window you need, button 1 down (ie, left click) and HOLD to pick up the file, button 4 to fan out your windows so you can choose your Mail message again and then let up on button 1 to drop the file as an attachment into the email.</p>
<p>EDIT: And FWIW, I am sort of against the frames thing because it splits the userbase into those who like it and those who don&#8217;t. Which means I have to dictate a preference so that our stations remain interchangeable. More pain for the IT mgr.</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Mullin</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-469521</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Mullin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 20:45:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-469521</guid>
		<description>Yea!
ive recently found a job working with a mac. i see no advantage to having all my windows hanging around. If someone could explain why, please do. ive been asking for months and all i get is &quot;you just dont like macs.&quot; so if you have an answer and a little time...

thanks for the option-click tip, certainly will help me cope.

ray</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yea!<br />
ive recently found a job working with a mac. i see no advantage to having all my windows hanging around. If someone could explain why, please do. ive been asking for months and all i get is &#8220;you just dont like macs.&#8221; so if you have an answer and a little time&#8230;</p>
<p>thanks for the option-click tip, certainly will help me cope.</p>
<p>ray</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Levine</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-469506</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Levine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 14:01:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-469506</guid>
		<description>@Fred: Not necessarily.

I do training and consulting work. Many, but not all of my clients are Mac based. While it&#039;s really not that big a deal to use a Windows version for demos and training I like the idea of having the best of both worlds especially if one of those rare O/S based issues arises.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Fred: Not necessarily.</p>
<p>I do training and consulting work. Many, but not all of my clients are Mac based. While it&#8217;s really not that big a deal to use a Windows version for demos and training I like the idea of having the best of both worlds especially if one of those rare O/S based issues arises.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Werner</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-469502</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Werner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 13:07:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-469502</guid>
		<description>&gt;I’m baffled by the “option-click the desktop” line. What does that do that a plain old click doesn’t?

If I simply click the desktop when visible it makes the Finder the current application but it doesn&#039;t hide InDesign. I won&#039;t be able to see the desktop.

Option-clicking make the Finder active, and HIDES InDesign, showing the desktop.

That keyboard shortcut works in any other Mac OS X application, but actually goes back to Mac OS 9 or earlier.

There are of course other ways of getting to the desktop but that one is strongly embedded in my memory.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;I’m baffled by the “option-click the desktop” line. What does that do that a plain old click doesn’t?</p>
<p>If I simply click the desktop when visible it makes the Finder the current application but it doesn&#8217;t hide InDesign. I won&#8217;t be able to see the desktop.</p>
<p>Option-clicking make the Finder active, and HIDES InDesign, showing the desktop.</p>
<p>That keyboard shortcut works in any other Mac OS X application, but actually goes back to Mac OS 9 or earlier.</p>
<p>There are of course other ways of getting to the desktop but that one is strongly embedded in my memory.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Saunders</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-469494</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Saunders</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 11:53:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-469494</guid>
		<description>My opinion was (as usual) deliberately overstated, but for me, it is essential, even on my trusty old 1280 x 854 tiBook, to have an InDesign document and an ESTK script side-by-side so I can be working with both at once. The application frame just adds too much space overhead. It would take a pair of monitors to make their use viable for this kind of activity.

Dave</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My opinion was (as usual) deliberately overstated, but for me, it is essential, even on my trusty old 1280 x 854 tiBook, to have an InDesign document and an ESTK script side-by-side so I can be working with both at once. The application frame just adds too much space overhead. It would take a pair of monitors to make their use viable for this kind of activity.</p>
<p>Dave</p>
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		<title>By: DrWatson</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-469487</link>
		<dc:creator>DrWatson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 08:10:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-469487</guid>
		<description>No, this isn&#039;t about &quot;being different&quot;. And in betas, which most of us/those, who are disgruntled, the Application frame was turned on by default (Fireworks). However, the Applicaton frame (or tabs) breaks Exposé, which is about breaking habits, breaking workflows -- that&#039;s why I personally don&#039;t like it and will never use it. Since it&#039;s an option, I&#039;m not too concerned about it at all ;) 

What about using two monitors, by the way? With the Application frame turned on, how does this work? Does it work at all (giben that the two monitors are of different sizes...)? (I&#039;m not having the final version, as we Europeans still have to wait for whatever reasons :/)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, this isn&#8217;t about &#8220;being different&#8221;. And in betas, which most of us/those, who are disgruntled, the Application frame was turned on by default (Fireworks). However, the Applicaton frame (or tabs) breaks Exposé, which is about breaking habits, breaking workflows &#8212; that&#8217;s why I personally don&#8217;t like it and will never use it. Since it&#8217;s an option, I&#8217;m not too concerned about it at all <img src='http://indesignsecrets.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>What about using two monitors, by the way? With the Application frame turned on, how does this work? Does it work at all (giben that the two monitors are of different sizes&#8230;)? (I&#8217;m not having the final version, as we Europeans still have to wait for whatever reasons :/)</p>
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		<title>By: Roland</title>
		<link>http://indesignsecrets.com/cs4s-application-frame-yea-or-nea.php/comment-page-1#comment-469485</link>
		<dc:creator>Roland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 07:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://indesignsecrets.com/?p=2085#comment-469485</guid>
		<description>This is a clear cut case of Mac fans doing their &quot;but we want to be different&quot; thing. It&#039;s an option that&#039;s turned off by default, so they have nothing to b**ch about.

Adobe needs an Officer Barbrady posting in their forums: Nothing to see here people... move along.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a clear cut case of Mac fans doing their &#8220;but we want to be different&#8221; thing. It&#8217;s an option that&#8217;s turned off by default, so they have nothing to b**ch about.</p>
<p>Adobe needs an Officer Barbrady posting in their forums: Nothing to see here people&#8230; move along.</p>
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