Scaling vs. Resizing in InDesign CS3
We’ve been getting a lot of questions from folks who’ve upgraded to CS3, asking what happened to the Transform Content command and how they’re supposed to transform a frame separately from its content (or vice versa), in InDesign CS3. Our friend Michael Ninness (the new InDesign Senior Product Manager at Adobe) recently wrote to us with a good explanation of this, so instead of writing it up ourselves, I’m just going to reprint what he wrote (with his permission):
Hi David,
Unfortunately, the Help documentation on this matter is a bit confusing. I thought your readers might appreciate an accurate description of the CS3 behavior.
The Transform Content menu command is gone in CS3, mainly because you don’t need it anymore. Here’s the skinny…
There is a difference between resizing something vs. scaling something in InDesign. Resizing is simply changing the Width and/or Height values of an object (i.e. picas, points, inches, etc.), whereas scaling involves using a percentage value and makes reference to the frame’s original “scale” (100%).
Resize a Frame
By default, when the frame is selected (and not the frame contents) changing the values of the Width and Height fields will only change the frame, not its contents, regardless of what selection tool you have active.
Scale a Frame and its Content
When the frame is selected (and not the frame’s contents) with the Selection tool, changing the values of the Scale X Percentage and Scale Y Percentage fields always changes the frame and its content.
Resize or Scale a Frame’s content
If you want to change only the content (resize or scale) of a frame, then you need to select the frame content first. You can do that by clicking on the Frame content with the Direct Selection tool, or you can double-click with the Selection tool to automatically switch to the Direct Selection tool. Once selected, you can use the W/H (resize) or the Scale fields depending on your preference.
The above behaviors apply to both the Transform panel and the Transform widgets in the Control panel.
Extra Credit
If you want to scale the width/height of a frame or its contents by a percentage, and have the results returned in the current measurement system, you can enter in a number with the percent sign to override the default measurement system. For example, if the current width is 12p, and you want the new width to be 75% of the current value, you can enter “75%” into the Width field. After you press Enter, the new value for the Width would display as 9p.
The opposite is true for the Scale fields, in that you can use other measurement system values if you want to scale to a specific increment, but have the results display in percent of the original. For example, you can replace 100% with 9p and InDesign will figure out what percentage was required to make it that width/height.
RotateThe Rotate widget rotates both the frame and its content when the frame is selected with the Selection tool.
If you only want to rotate the frame content, select the content first with the Direct Selection tool.
If you only want to rotate the frame, select the frame with the Direct Selection tool, then click on the hollow dot in the middle of the Frame bounding box to select all the anchor points of the Frame. Then change the Rotate value.
Cheers,
Michael Ninness
InDesign Senior Product Manager
There’s plenty more to scaling in InDesign, of course. But this is a great primer to get started. And it explains a few things that have really confused readers. For example, many CS3 users can’t figure out how to scale a group of objects to a specific height or width: In CS2 you could simply change the value in the W or H fields. In CS3, you have to do this in the X or Y Scale fields!
Let us know what you think is helpful or frustrating for you with these new scaling shenanigans below!
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Hi. Great tips. Makes sense and is going to be very useful to me. After some testing of this tip I have realised why sometimes my text reflows when I scale. As an example, if I scale down a poster to a much smaller advert size I find that the text can run onto more lines. I have narrowed this behavior down to the text ‘Kerning’ set to ‘Optical’ – which I suppose is obvious now I think about it. If the Kerning is set to Metrics then it doesn’t reflow when scaled.
Yes, I’m glad Michael took the time to write that out. I think the scaling logic in CS3, once you get used to it, is somewhat clearer than in earlier versions, but there’s still some muddy areas there.
For example, I’d like to know how you can select “the frame, but not its contents” with the Selection tool; as Michael mentions a few times in his instructions. If I select a text or image frame with the Selection tool and then drag it around, or rotate it or flip it, both the frame and the contents change. So haven’t I selected both? AFAIK the only way to select “just the frame, not the contents” is with the Direct Selection tool (as he mentions toward the end).
In the end, I just accept that of all the transforms, it’s the *scaling* one that’s squirrely, so I’ve made peace. ;-)
And I have to say I love the ability to enter measures in the scaling field. I use that all the time now. If I have a selection of three images that need to fit in a 27p wide column, I just select them, enter 27p in the Scale field, and I’m good to go.
I quite like the way the scaling is done. I usually CTRL ALT SHIFT click and drag to rescale. The X and Y scale remains at 100% but if I select the image with the direct select tool i can see the percentage it is scaled to.
You can flip the content without flipping the box, if you select the content with the D.S. tool and then flip, the box remains unflipped.
I would say that the number one wish list item I have around scaling at this point is that I want both Frame and Content scaling fields visible in the Control panel so I can constantly see (and set) an image’s scaling without having to choose it with the Direct Selection tool.
Oooh! I want that too David! Sigh… our work is never done. :)
Great feature idea….let me know when it’s coming so I can get myself a 30″ monitor to hold all that info in the control panel. :)
This is very helpful information that wasn’t quite obvious when first switching to CS3. The only problem I have is this:
Previously, I could resize an image and its frame with command-size. If the frame had a stroke set (1pt for example) when I resized it, the stroke stayed set to 1pt. In CS3, the stroke size is scaled so I have to reset it if I want it to remain 1pt. This is with the ‘when scaling’ preference set to ‘apply to content’. If the preference is set to ‘adjust scaling percentage’ then the stroke remains, but anything applied to the object is also scaled (such as text wraps, etc). I can’t seem to find a simple way to apply a style to my object and then resize it without some measurement being off and having to be manually reset.
The info has been extremely helpful but I have to say that I miss the way CS2 handled frames and content. Being able to resize both at the same time and then go back to check the percentage increase of the content to ensure the dpi wasn’t too low made life very simple if you had cropped an image and then had to resize it.
David’s suggstion of having both frame and content scaling visible at the same time is a great one — maybe in CS4 they will find a better way and keep things a bit simpler.
The way ID CS3 handles scaling is a giant step backwards (even if the setting based “Transform contents” feature was admittedly awkward).
Now there is no longer a direct way to scale a frame with contents to a specified width or height (and keep aspect ratio, if needed). This is important when you have cropped an image and wish to scale it afterwards to some numeric value (instead of needing to use the mouse).
This is the way I wish the feature would work in the future:
A. Frame selected (with regular selection tool)
a) Accepting with Enter key: the mere frame is transformed according to the values of Width and Scale boxes (as now).
b) Accepting with Shift+Enter key: the mere frame is transformed according to the value of the Width OR Height box and the aspect ratio is retained (analogous with the mouse operation, Shift constrains).
c) Accepting with Ctrl+Enter: the frame AND contents transformed according to the values of Width and Scale boxes (image can be distorted), analogously with mouse operation (Ctrl transforms contents with the frame).
d) Accepting with Shift+Ctrl+Enter: the frame AND contents transformed according to the value entered in the Width OR Height box, and aspect ratio is retained, analogously with mouse operation (Ctrl+Shift constrains the aspect ratio and transforms contents with the frame).
B. Contents selected (with direct selection tool):
The same as above but in stage a) and b)only the contents is affected. Stages c) and d) behave similarly as above.
Holding down the Alt key would apply the transformation on a copy (as it does now).
Note: There is a workaround for content+frame transformation with the Width or Height box, if you use the Scale box (just type in the scale ratio x 100, and hit Ctrl+Enter, e.g. to go from the width of 150 mm to 100 mm, you would type 10000/150 in the Scale Width box).
Arto: I think perhaps you need to read the post at the top of this page again. There is a very easy way to set the width or height of a frame AND its contents: Just use the X and Y scale field in the Control panel.
However, I like your ideas of using modifier keys for different meanings in the H and W fields.
Oops. Sorry for not having read what was said above: so there IS a way to scale to specific width or height by entering a measure in the Scale boxes. This is great!
Still, it would be useful to have Width and Height boxes work as content transformers when using modifier keys (preferably Ctrl as content transformation key and Shift as the constrain key).
I really like how this works, especially now that I know how it works :)
Makes oodles of sense to me, as I always absolutely hated the transform content option.
I don’t know if this is relevant or not. But…
Edit>Preferences>When Scaling
I have selected Adjust Scaling Percentage instead of Apply to Content.
Now when I scale an image I can see the percentage that it is scaled to without having to use the direct selction tool. I can also see the physical width of the container plus the scaling all at the same time.
I think I may leave it like that, any reasons not to?
Also with this, wouldn’t it be cool if you had a DPI counter on the control panel or something to show the DPI as you scale the image.
Sorry for being repetitive here, but ooh this is funky. I changed back my preferences to see if the image still behaved this way with the scaling display. And it does. I then placed the same image in again, and the scaling display behaves differently. And the other image keeps on displaying the size.
I don’t know if I worded that well?
Eugene, yes, the Adjust Scaling Percentage thing can be useful, but it plays havoc when scaling text frames (you get those parentheses all the time). Anne-Marie pointed out in one of our recent podcasts that she likes it because she doesn’t scale text frames. If you only scale images, it’s a pretty good system.
As for the dpi counter: That already exists in the Info palette! I love that feature.
Sweet, the little things you learn are the one’s that let you do the biggest jobs.
Thanks David.
CS3’s handling of scaling is a huge step backward for me as well. In CS2 I could select the frame with the Selection tool and then scale the frame and its contents 5% at a time from the keyboard with Option-Cmd-comma or period.Try doing the same in CS3. This change was a big mistake in my opinion, and hopefully will be rectified in CS4.
Scott, that’s a good reminder. Don’t forget about Sandee’s script (see comments 5 and 6 in podcast 56).
David, you just made my day, week, month, and year. I hadn’t heard of Sandee’s scripts, which work perfectly. Many thanks for the alert. I’m a happy guy!
I read the blog and I am even more ticked off at the hubris implied “The Transform Content menu command is gone in CS3, mainly because you don?t need it anymore.” I was happy see there are many who agree with me, after all my goal is to get to working only 2 days a week “long live Taz”, without a keyboard short cut that means many mouse trips to the transform pallet, try doing this for a 48 page magazine with tons of photos and editors constantly changing the layout, nudging this photo up/down in size and you will quickly understand why I am peeved. Please put it back! If it ain’t broken don’t fix it.
I never had any problems with the way scaling/resizing was handled in CS2, and this change in CS3 has thrown me off.
Though I’m sure the new functionality was included for good reason, losing the option for a CS2-style workflow seems like a step backward.
I like that with the CS3 changes I can keep the basic CS2 W/H resizing functionality by adding units to override the default percent units when I enter numbers in the X/Y scaling — e.g. 1″ or 1in will scale by inches instead of percent.
The one simple (in the eyes of a non-programmer) thing that would make this cleaner for me is a Preferences option for default scaling units.
If Preferences allowed a user to set the default scaling units for inches, picas, points, or percent, then I think the functionality would fit more people’s workflows.
This new scaling seems very counter-productive. Can anyone tell me if the following still works: resize a text box with the selection tool grabbing an end, and constrain the scaling pivot to the center (i.e. how holding ‘alt’ in CS2 and previous used to do). thanks
The Alt trick to scale from the centerpoint only works with the Free Transform tool. I believe that hasn’t changed.
Guys, I followed this (after a glass of wine) but could only find problems similar to mine. See if I’m talking nonsense: If you have a couple of images on one page and group them and THEN resize the group, I now have the frames moving but not the content. I have to now in CS3 ungroup match content to frame and then regroup again. At least it works this way – but CS2 didn’t do this. Is this just the wine talking?
I was wondering if someone can clarify something for me. I am still having problems resizing images. Typically I Ctrl+Shift on a PC and grab a corner to resize proportionally but occassionally I like to make all my images a certain width which in CS was done simply entering a W or H. In CS3 however this just resizes the frame and then you have to fit content to frame to resize the image within, increasing the number of steps. I know there has to be a one step fix for this problem. I tried all the options offered but I must just be missing something obvious. Please help!
One additional note, I did find typing in a specified width into the percentage box but is there a way to set that to default to inches instead of percent?
Sorry, John, you can’t change % to show in inches. They’re scaling fields. But as you discovered, you can type in measurements.
OK, Thats the conclusion I came to but thanks for the confirmation. I am getting used to it now
I posted a question in the Adobe forums regarding scaling issues, and was directed to Sandee’s scripts (mentioned above) that basically give you the same kbsc’s as CS2. Amazing how something so small (that you’ve become accustomed to) can drive you crazy when it doesn’t work the same way anymore! Thanks for your email, David!
I agree with Richard@22 that the scaling units should be set by the user. In CS2, I often tweak object sizes by editing the numbers in the Resize fields (ie. 5.27″ becomes 5.25″). In order to be that precise in CS3, I have to type 5 characters in the Scale field instead of one character in the Resize field.
Unfortunately, there seems to be no choice but to use this method if you have content that isn’t exactly sized to your frame.
Please fix :)
How is this? I have an image, cropped in ID. When I select it, I see that it´s 125 mm wide. Then I edit it in Photoshop, change the resolution and place the edited image to replace the original. Now the cropping of image changes, and the width and height of image grow. ok. BUT when I select it with direct selection tool, the control palette still says that it is 125 mm wide. Why? Clearly the measurements have changed, how do I see the true measurements?
OK. I can scale a single frame and its image content to, say 50mm wide, but, with CS2 I did that and then used Transform Again Individually to do the same with the other 19 images on a spread. If I try this in CS3 (apart from the hassle of every time having to select “Show all menu items” to get to the option), the other 19 are not reduced/increased to 50 mm wide as in CS2, they are altered by the same percentage value as was used to make the first image 50mm wide. Or am I missing something?
Alan, that’s a great point! Dang, that is a problem with this new system. (For more info on this feature for other folks, see this post.)
ok, i have to rotate the frame but not the image. in other words i have to leave the image rotated and square up the image. How do i do this now, when before i could turn transform content off????
sorry, i meant i have to leave the image rotated and square up the frame..oops
Nick, as we mentioned earlier, you just need to adjust the image or the frame separately with the Direct Selection tool. If you want the image to rotate without the frame, just click on it with the Direct Selection tool and change its rotation.
I really hate that I can’t size the image and frame by using the apple key and greater and less then keys! WHY did you have to change this?? It makes me sick!
ok, so where is the key command for scale object and content…it used to be command – option – for up??? is this entirely gone?? :(
Juliann, please read the comments after the post.
To Michael Ninnes:
To say You don´t need the numeric resize option any more is something I definitely don´t agree with. What was so simple in CS2 suddendly disappeared. You cannot resize pictures with frames to certain sizes any more easily, neither with groups.
Hope Adobe fixes that soon. Looks like this was a step in the wrong direction.
Nikolaus
I too was disappointed to no longer be able to set a specific width/height to an image and frame, logically through the width/height fields. I used that all the time.
I’m glad to now know there is a workaround to make this happen using the scale fields, but it’s not very intuitive.
What I’m missing here is why this changed.
I’m a big Adobe fan, so since I’ve been using CS3 for a while and grumbling every time I had to use to steps to size things to particular dimensions — up until now, I kept thinking that there must be some hidden benefit to this new way that just hasn’t revealed itself yet.
Please enlighten me. I haven’t found it.
I was happy with the old way.
Diana
PLEASE HELP!!!
I used to use option, apple and the keys to resize BOTH the frame and content. I found it easy to use these keys. Now when I use these keys I can either resize the frame and NOT the content inside OR the content inside and NOT the frame. Its REALLY annoying now, especially when I have cropped multiple images in different frames and need to resize them – Is there any other way then having to group them, then use the mouse and the shift and apple keys while dragging??
sorry i meant the , and . keys along with apple and option
Dean, check out this post about the scaling shortcuts solution.
[…] PostsScaling vs. Resizing in InDesign CS3 by David Blatner Getting Rid of Text Size Parentheses by David Blatner Scale Graphic and Frame in […]
“To resize a frame, drag any handle using the Selection tool. If you hold down Ctrl (Windows) or Command (Mac OS) while dragging, the frame and the content are scaled. Adding the Shift key scales proportionally.” [CS4 help]
– I have a problem in CS4. resizing frame & content don’t work when i hold down Ctrl key. Resize only the frame, NOT the object inside. In older version [CS, CS2] this works OK = resized frame & content too. Please help with CS4, i don’t know who is the prob. :(
Resizing with shortcuts “,” & “.” works OK, but resizing manually with mouse-drag Nope.
[sorry for bad english]
@Thomas: Are you scaling a frame and an image? A frame and text? Both of these work for me in CS4. Does it work for you with the Free Transform tool?
David:
I try to scale a frame+image[with clip path]. Frame+text dont works too. Scaled is always the frame only. The content of frame [any type] is dont scaled – when i drag with “Selection Tool” [+hold the Ctrl].
Free Transform tool works without problems and the content is scaled with frame [images OK, text OK].
My Ctrl key is OK, must be a bug with Selection Tool in my version of installation. I dont know. I never seen this problem in other versions of ID.
Thanks for your time…
Yes!!!
I have it! Its a bad bug with Ctrl holding. When i drag the frame with mouse first & push the Ctrl key when mouse dragging is still active the object is dont scaled, only the frame.
When pushing down Ctrl key & the mouse dragging is only the second action after the Ctrl pushed and hold down it works good. I dont realy know why this priority choice of Ctrl key. In older versions this priority dont needed & the object scaled always, when Ctrl is hold down > when i drop the frame with mouse.
[heh, & sorry for english, i am a bad “speaker”] :)
By the way, note that the keyboard shortcut behavior has changed again (a little) in CS4. Now you have two different options: Scale and Resize.
Hello to All,
I’m new to this site and I don’t know if this question has been posted before:
I’m an architectural drafter and the program I mostly use is AutoCAD LT2005. In this program we have the option of working in Model Space (when we print we can assign an architectural/engineering scale to our drawings) or in Paper Space (when we draw and print we are using actual sizes in feet and inches).
I was drawing a school sign in Paper Space to get the actual size of the sign and letters in inches and fractions of inches for the letters. I can’t adjust the width of the letters and spaces between the letters in this version of AutoCAD, so I decided to switch to InDesign CS3.
How can I adjust the units to print the text in the actual size it will be done on the sign? Please advise, I’m I relatively new InDesign user.
Thank you.
@Gabriela: Are you saying you want to be able to specify that a capital letter be exactly 1 inch tall, or something like that? Unfortunately, InDesign does not let you do that. If you specify 72 pt (which normally = 1 inch) text, the cap could be larger or (probably) smaller than that. It all depends on the font itself.
Reading the discussion of scaling above, I’m puzzled by this:
“When the frame is selected (and not the frame?s contents) with the Selection tool, changing the values of the Scale X Percentage and Scale Y Percentage fields always changes the frame and its content.”
I can’t get this to work in the way I’m understanding it to work. Changing X and Y just makes the object and frame change position, rather than scaling.
I’m using the Selection tool and clicking on the framed object. Does this equal “selecting the frame and not the frame’s contents”?
I’m also puzzled by “percentage” because the X and Y fields show a unit of measure, not a percentage.
What am I doing wrong?
@Tim: I can see how that could be be confusing. However, the “Scale X Percentage” is not the field labeled “X”. It’s the one that is usually third over on the top of the Control panel. If you hover your mouse over it, you should see a tool tip pop up that says “Scale X Percentage.”
Ah, I see! Got it. Thanks.
ProScale from GLUON does it all
https://store.gluon.com/Products/ProScaleIDCS3.dmg
[…] Scale – The scale information will not be displayed if you scale with the control panel, however if you scale with the scale tool it will display the exact same information as the control. Once again, the free transform tool has a unique way of displaying information. After you scale an object and release the mouse it will display the amount that you have scaled whereas the control panel immediately resets back to 100%. The info panel will clear back to 100% as soon as you switch to another tool, but this can let you see your actually scale amount without having to nervously hold down the mouse button. For more info on scaling please read Davids extensive article on the subject of scaling. […]
When using the scaling tool in CS4 to resize a frame and its contents, in one direction only, all the text in the frame is not resizing. It actually just reflows to fit the smaller space. I do have ‘apply to contents when scaling’ selected in the preferences. Does anyone have any suggestions or ideas?
My content still will not change. It makes the frame box bigger but the content still stays the same. I placed a 2″ square picture into a document and it shows up as .0417″. When I resize, it only makes a bigger frame box. I want to throw my computer off my desk right about now! Someone help??
@Tim and Cliff: I don’t know what the problem is, but it sounds more like you have the Selection tool (black arrow) selected, not the Scale or Free Transform tool.
Thanks for the tip. It helped a bunch!
Which box is the actual size in idensign? there is a pink/purple outline, a black outline, and the red outline….which one is my actual board size?
@Jenna: The black edge is the edge of the page. The pink/purple lines are margin and column guides. The red outline is the bleed guide.
We replaced my hard drive with a solid state drive and with it we reinstalled CS3. Now some of my preferences are gone and I can’t figure out how to get them back. One that I had was when I scaled a graphic down or up the percentage it was scaled to stayed in the control panel. For instance: I import a graphic but it is too large so I scale it down to 25% of original. 25% would stay in the box that shows scaling. Now it automatically goes back to 100% so I have no idea how much I scaled the graphic. I want this back and can’t find the place to change it. Can you help?
Carol: Choose Adjust Scaling Percentage in the General pane of the Preferences dialog box.
Thank you so much David! I have another questions. We also installed Windows 7 when we replaced the hard drive. Just FYI for this next question. InDesign used to open files with the ruler showing. It doesn’t do that anymore and I am constantly hitting Ctrl-R. Is there somewhere I can change the setting for the ruler? I truly appreciate your help.
Carol: While no documents are open, choose View > Show Rulers. (Changing things when no docs are open changes the default settings.)
I want to select the content of a graphic frame (the graphic). It is currently scaled to 81.###% and change the percentage to 75%. By that I mean that after the command, the graphic will be at 75% of it’s original size.
There’s a drop down list in the Scale X Y fields that shows percentages. When I select the Content of the frame and choose 75% the graphic scales perfectly. But I have to move the mouse to do this. I want commands that I can invoke with kbs.
So I tried Object > Transform > Scale and entered 75% in that fields for X and Y. The object scales to 75% of 81.###%. (About 61.###%.)
This doesn’t make sense.
I tried entering 75% in the X (width) and Y (height) fields. Again, the content is scaled to 61.###%.
I’ve asked two scripter friends to help. But I wondered if the geniuses here know a solution.
Basically I need to be able to do this completely with keystrokes.
With the frame selected, press shift+esc to select the graphic. Then press cmd+opt+6 to highlight the first field in the Control panel. Hit Tab 5 times. Now you’re in the horizontal scale field. Enter 75 or whatever % you want. How’s that?
Wow! Thanks Mike.
That’s a lot of tap, tap, tabbing. But it does work.
However, Cmd-Opt-6 hides the Control panel if it is shown. But choose it again and the panel shows up with the first field highlighted ready for tap, tap, tab.
But Cmd-6 jumps right into the field.
Ah, thanks for the correction. Yes, it is a very tappy way to go about it. You’d have to tap pretty quick for it to be faster than mousing. It’s too bad there’s no direct keyboard access to the scale fields. You’d think there would be.
And if you need to change the reference point before scaling, hit shift-tab right after command+option+6. This highlights the reference point controls, and you can use your up/down/left/right arrow keys to pick a different reference point.
It’s not just that there’s a lot of tapping. It’s that the fields to Scale XY are not the same as the Scale XY fields in the Transform > Scale dialog box.
This isn’t just an annoyance. It feels like a bug. The interface says the same thing in two places but does different things.