*** From the Archives ***
This article is from May 20, 2008, and is no longer current.
Printing to Inkjets from Mac Can Cause Color Shifts in CS3
Barney wrote:
Using the same color profile on InDesign as in Photoshop (in CS3, on a Mac) results in different outputs. It seems that to get good matches, you have to create new InDesign-specific profiles.
This one was really baffling, especially because after doing some research we found that it actually works fine when printing from CS2, and even in CS3 for Windows. However, there does appear to be a problem with printing from InDesign CS3 to non-PostScript printers (such as inkjets) on the Mac. This is a significant problem for people using inkjet printers for proofing, and especially for photographers, who often use inkjets for their final output.
Lucky for us, color management expert Chris Murphy (co-author of Real World Color Management and the video author of the color management title at lynda.com) came up with an answer:
Regarding printing from InDesign to RGB output devices (this includes essentially all inkjet printers from every manufacturer, when driven by the manufacturer print driver… inkjet printers driven by a PostScript RIP are considered CMYK output devices, and thus this post does not apply to them):
When printing to RGB output devices from InDesign using the same ICC profiles and settings as in Photoshop, you still get crummy results, in terms of color, that differ from both IDCS2 and other Adobe applications including Photoshop CS3.
InDesign CS2 previously did all rasterizing and color space conversion in InDesign prior to submitting the print job to the OS. In CS3 this was changed to submit PostScript + colorspace information, which is then supposed to be normalized by the OS. Except that it doesn’t work. Mac OS X drops the color space information.
The workaround is to enable “Print as Bitmap” in the Advanced pane of the Print dialog in InDesign. This causes IDCS3 to do the conversion and generate a bitmap prior to submitting to the OS (the default behavior with IDCS2), rather than depending on the OS to do color conversion or rasterizing. Thus you can use the same ICC profiles and print driver settings as with all other Adobe applications if you choose this option.
This was a revelation to me. I knew that Print as Bitmap was added in CS3, but I didn’t really consider how significant it could be to the printing process. Again, the Print as Bitmap checkbox is only relevant when printing to non-PostScript devices (such as inkjets).
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Wow! That’s new to me. I remember that somebody told me, that his printings in Photoshop and InDesign are different. I answered: No, no. Everything is fine in CS3. You’ve got the wrong colormanagement-settings.
Now I know…
Grettings from Germany
Martin
Hi. I also have this kind of problem with my hp colorlaserjet 3600. The colors were very dull. Read my posts here.
In the end the problem get “fixed” if I export the InDesign file as pdf and print it out of Apples preview and not with Acrobat.
I hope, this will help someone…
Best regards from Austria
Martin
Martin, please try the Print as Bitmap feature, as described here. Also, note that if your final artwork is to an RGB printer (or an inkjet printer, which should be treated as an RGB printer, even though it’s a CMYK device), you should probably be using Edit > Transparency Blend Space > RGB.
So this is, according to the heading, a Mac-only issue, and we Win users don’t have to worry about this particular snafu?
That is correct, as far as I know, Klaus. It’s likely a Tiger and/or Leopard bug (OS 10.4 or 10.5).
Regarding the blend space, YES, this matters hugely when printing to inkjet printers! They’re using CMYK inks, of course, but their drivers are in RGB land — and failing to set the blend space to RGB will mess up color management royally, and you’ll never make sense of the odd results. I learned this the usual way: the harrrrrrd way.
Why does Adobe do these things?
If something isn’t broken please leave it alone! just found out after spending 4 hours imposing a perfect bound book using FPO’s in an OPI workflow in Indy CS3 that Adobe changed PDF export to strip OPI comments from PDF’s. Just another example of changing things that didn’t need to be changed.
almaink, it’s just too easy for us outsiders to say to Adobe “it’s not broken, so please leave it alone.” There are vast software engineering issues involved all across the core technologies of the CS packages, and huge code revisions are necessary for each major release. It’s inevitable that something which worked fine in CSX may become broken in CSX+1, not because of Adobe’s incompetence, but because software engineering on this level is staggeringly complex and bugs will happen. Yes, it hurts us when such merde shits a fan, but it’s not really fair to Adobe to complain that they don’t know well enough to leave the “unbroken” stuff alone.
Umm, that should have been “merde hits the fan”! Sorry about my pleonastic parapraxis. :-)
Sorry, the “staggeringly complex and bugs will happen” argument doesn’t absolve Adobe from alerting users of changes in their software for mission critical prepress work.
Ah yes, remember the days when Adobe Pagemaker didn’t have 2-way communication with the printer and you’d end up with yards of film with Courier font substitutions?
The only thing I can say about the change is that they made it for a specific reason. Perhaps before it didn’t suit a lot of users so they changed it. Now that it’s changed it doesn’t suit the users who were happy with the way it works.
The only way you can make a difference is by adding your spiel to the Adobe Wishlist over on their site.
I agree with MichaelG that while it is unfortunate that Adobe did not test this originally, they should be issuing some official technical bulletin or document instructing users on a procedure for reliable color output on the Mac. I was unable to find anything on this through a search in the knowledge base.
Are there any down sides to using the Print as Bitmap method?
And what does Apple have to say for their part?
Al
Thank you! This, coupled with much researching on the Canon printer driver has led to a solution of a InDesign colour matched output to Photoshop!!! I am so excited.
So two things need to be true for a Mac to print correctly with Canon Pro 9000 out of InDesign:
1. You need to print as a bitmapped image, as is suggested here
2. AND you need print using Canon’s older non-CUPS (non 16 bit) printer driver (v.4.8.6) (which can be downloaded from the canon website). With this driver, you can select “Vendor Matching” under colour management and set colour correction to off under colour options. In the newer printer driver, colour management is automatically turned on/off by the supporting application – which works with Photoshop, but doesn’t with InDesign. So by going back to the older printer driver with InDesign you regain manual control of colour correction.
It’s only the combination of 1 & 2 that makes InDesign work correctly on the mac with the Pro 9000.
Thanks for this article, but I’m still having problems printing from Illustrator and Indesign with my new Pro9000.
First of all, when I print from every Adobe application except for Photoshop I see in the printer dialog box an option for ColorSync or Vendor. In photoshop both options are “greyed out”. So if they aren’t greyed out in Illustrator, Acrobat, Indesign, does that mean that the document is being double color managed?
Also, in every Adobe program except for photoshop I’m getting totally wacky colors. They don’t even come close to my pantone swatches. So, with the exception of photoshop, I can’t get any color accuracy with this Pro9000.
Does anyone have any new information about this? The last comment by Barney stated that not only do you need to convert to Bitmap, you have to have an older Canon driver. I’ve tried to download the driver from Canons website and it installs successfully, but still having the exact same problems with the color.
This is kind of getting out of hand with this printer. Every designer in the world needs their printer to work with the Adobe suite. And this printer doesn’t. I’ve read multiple internet posts asking these same questions about this printer. It’s absolutely insane that this doesn’t work right out of the box.
Please if anyone has any more information about how to get this printer to produce accurate colors in Adobe apps besides photoshop. Please share! I’m about to get rid of this thing and get an Epson.
The problem with IDCS3 is that the monitor profile is being introduced into the RGB print flow.
To test this, try using a different monitor profile and you will see that there are changes in the way the print will look.
I discovered this when I realized that a profile created for IDCS3 printed different on different computers.
This has been extremely helpful. I upgraded from CS to CS3 and the print quality using the new version ID was dark and, frankly, horrible. My printer is an Epson Photo R800. Using the bitmap option has made all the difference, coupled with a different ICC profile (I print brochures on HP 180gsm Inkjet Superior) The ICC profile I found that works best for this (although if somebody knows one that’s better I’d welcome the advice) is the catchily named Epson SPR800 EnhMtteBstPhoto R1 – downloadable from their website
Oh my God! I have been having print error problems ever since I upgraded to CS3 and bought a Canon Pro 9000. Couldn’t print at all from InDesign or Acrobat. Was getting ‘pstopffilter’ error. Color correction issues aside, now at least I can actually print. This also led me to check the ‘print as image’ in the Acrobat print dialogue box. You made my year! This was driving me mad! Was having to convert everything to Photoshop files. Whoohoo!
Replaced all my usb cables and switches before realizing this problem.
Look, if Adobe is going to charge this much money for these sophisticated programs then they should take the responsibility to notify users of these changes. This is what you get however when a company gets too big and monopolizes their field. “Absolute Power corrupts absolutely!”
Another question. Is printing a bitmap image in 300 or 600 dpi giving you the same quality and resolution as printing straight to 2800 dpi on a printer??
What quality changes occur when printing a bitmap image?
Crus
Thanks to Chris Murphy, and to this forum, for his advice: “…enable ?Print as Bitmap? in the Advanced pane of the Print dialog in InDesign.” For some reason I tried a few other methods, some suggested by people here (printing a PDF from Preview, printing a PDF opened in Potoshop), before I tried Murphy’s tip, but his definitely got me closest to what I was seeing on my screen in InDesign (CS3 on a Mac w/ OS 10.4.11). Not perfect, almost there.
Unanswered questions from above:
Al: Are there any down sides to using the Print as Bitmap method?
Crus: Is printing a bitmap image in 300 or 600 dpi giving you the same quality and resolution as printing straight to 2800 dpi on a printer?? What quality changes occur when printing a bitmap image?
Could someone address these questions? Like many of you, I have been pulling my hair out over good color prints from Photoshop vs. flat, dull prints from InDesign (from the same graphic file).
Thank God for this workaround–BUT I am also wondering what the drawbacks are to using the “Print as Bitmap” option. I’ve scrutinized my prints and I could be imagining it, but I think they do look a little posterized compared with the “non-bitmap” dull prints and the print that was output by Photoshop.
So I would love to know if there are drawbacks to the “print as bitmap” option at all. Thanks for your incredibly helpful thread!
It appears that after all this time that the issue of the monitor profile being introduced into the RGB printflow is now fixed with 10.6.2.
Thanks for this. I’ve been looking for some time now on what the problem might be, but have always come up blank. I stumbled here from another article at indesignsecrets.com. A bit late to the parade, but better late than never….
Does anyone know if this has been addressed in CS5? It drove me crazy for weeks when we switched to CS3. In CS4, we found we still needed to print as bitmap to get the color we wanted. I’m hoping that CS5 will finally address this.
Thanks!
See my post on this subject at:
https://creativepro.com/can-you-turn-off-color-mgmt.php#comment-486195